This post is open for anyone to ask a question relating to tutorial conversations or any of our course readings.
12 comments:
Anonymous
said...
Ashley Melo, In the novel, Our stories Our songs, What are the impediments and barriers to learning the childs voice when you dont speak the childs language? Or Are we listening to the voice of the child? Who is actually speaking? Are children saying what adults want them to say?
I wanted to say the following in class but we ran out of time. We spoke a whole lot on whether Gogo had the right to tell everyone that her son died due to AIDS at his funeral.One of the arguments was that she shouldn't have voiced this at the funeral which caused distress to the children. Someone mentioned that it didn't have an affect.
My argument is that I believe it did. Bitini's father was a respected man loved by many. In fact, Ellis also mentioned that there were many people present at his funeral. I think Gogo was right in choosing to tell everyone that he died due to AIDS because the many people present would take this to heart. Gogo created awareness with people who could relate to loosing a loved one to AIDS. When something happens to you or a loved one, you are more aware and you will try harder to cause awareness.
Moreover, he died due to AIDS, that was the truth and well, the truth hurts but lies hurt more.
I find that it is very important to educate her family about the dangers of AIDS and that they must be able to take care of themselves to prevent them from getting it. But on the other hand i find that Bambo's funeral was not the right place for Gogo to do this. Someone in tutorial had mentioned that when there is a death of someone due to the illness people would be more affected. I disagree with this because using the death of Bambo to educate the family on AIDS kind of direspects him in a way because of the fact that society looks down upon people who have this disease. Even if they are family, learning that Bambo had died of AIDS changes the perception that the family had of him. If they looked at the children resentfully, would they not have changed how they saw their brother learning this information?
Why doesn’t she write down the question that she is asking the children or is there something she is hiding? Common assumptions we think that children don’t understand what is happening but they just want to say what adult wants them to hear. The barrier to learning a childs voice is that the children are not given the opputunity to speak but are expected to answer questions.translation is not the best way to here a child because not every language have proper translation.
Just a comment on Renatha's comment. I don't think it degrades Bambo what so ever, if anything he might have wanted that exactly. Why wouldn't you explain to the children what actually happened? There was a whole argument in class about whether or not there should have been an educational period at the funeral. It came down to the well being of the two children left behind, but by not telling them would eventually in the future hurt their well being in health and even future family. It's much better to know what you have in order to be able to treat it or control it or to be able to give reason as to why things are happening. Coming down to the social construct of it all which was Renatha's argument, there has to be that first step to create awareness or else keeping it in the dark doesn't create change or even propose to spark a change within that society. Everyone at that funeral, left a little more knowledgeable about their surroundings even if it did cost the social well being of the two children. It sounds cruel. Bitini was a respected man within the village and his death brought about awareness of the disease and probably made a bigger impact just because he was respected by so many in the village. So good on you Gogo.
after reading half of "Our Stories, Our Songs" it seems like the children (age 7-17) are already maturing to adulthood since their parent's died and now how to deal with the reality of life. Most children in Canada don't deal with that maturity until their are in their 20's and 30's...it's interesting how they realise that life isn't simple anymore at a very young age
I don't see a problem with Gogo revealing this information at her son's funeral. It was, very practically, a good opportunity to speak to a large crowd. Of course, it also allowed Deborah Ellis to address the fact that people don't often speak openly about AIDS. Maybe Ellis wanted this to be a controversial part of the book so that readers would consider the importance of overcoming the social stigma attached to AIDS.
As for Our Stories, Our Songs, I agree that translation can be a barrier to hearing the actual voice of the child. I also think that the children's stories would appear more authentic if Ellis hadn't put their words into such perfect phrasing and grammatically correct sentences. Even though their stories are different, their voices seem to be exactly the same.
In regards to Renatha's comment: I do not think that this disrespects Bambo in fact I think he would be content with letting people know in order to spread awareness. For instance, when I tell people I got into a car accident, I am sure to mention that it was due to a drunk driver, in order to create awareness.
In addition, I'm sure many were affected; as for the uncle, he was simply the ignorant, selfish and cold character that Ellis decided to include in the novel. Anyway, the message cant be expected to get through to everyone. The fact remains that Im sure it affected at least a few.
In response to Ashley's comment: The fact that Ellis had to rely on translators may have caused some alterations and variations. I'd like to think that the voice is authentic but at times I couldn't understand or believe that children thought and spoke in that specific manner. Its authentic to an extent. What do others think?
Ramandeep Bains, After reading Our Stories Our Songs, I noticed that many of children just said their parents or relatives were sick and then they died. It probably meant they had aids, but they didn't talk about it. When we talked about if Gogo did the right thing to tell everyone her son died of aids some people agreed while others disagreed. I think she did the right thing and other people should talk about aids more openly because it will create awareness and it will get the issue of aids out in the open, which will hopefully make people do more about the aids crisis. I think it is really good that there are anti aids clubs and the kicking aids out project because it gives the kids a chance to talk about aids and also learn more about how to prevent it or how to live with it.
Just like to add to the discussion we had in class about Our Stories Our Songs. Leslie pointed out something that I wanted to comment on (which I agreed with). She mentioned the lack of detail in the book, which there was, but only to keep it simple for children to able to read. But there wasn't enough detail either, leaving any questions the children had for the parents to answer. This could pose a problem for the author who is trying to get out a certain message because it brings in another view point into the analysis of the story. So, if there is not enough detail to satisfy the child's curiosity, then we have questions being asked to the guardian's of the child which might distort the true meaning of the book, either because the parent does not actually know the definitive answer and creates a misrepresentation of what actually is going on in those countries, or because they just want to mess around with their kids head. Anyway that's my thought. woop.
how much detail is needed to understand the meaning that comes across in the message of the book? by saying there isn't enough detail for children to understand than that's staying that we don't think children are capable of disecting themes and messages writen in that book today in tutorial
i'm not being an asshole but i'm just trying to start a debate (if what i'm saying makes any sense)
12 comments:
Ashley Melo,
In the novel, Our stories Our songs, What are the impediments and barriers to learning the childs voice when you dont speak the childs language? Or
Are we listening to the voice of the child? Who is actually speaking? Are children saying what adults want them to say?
I wanted to say the following in class but we ran out of time. We spoke a whole lot on whether Gogo had the right to tell everyone that her son died due to AIDS at his funeral.One of the arguments was that she shouldn't have voiced this at the funeral which caused distress to the children. Someone mentioned that it didn't have an affect.
My argument is that I believe it did. Bitini's father was a respected man loved by many. In fact, Ellis also mentioned that there were many people present at his funeral. I think Gogo was right in choosing to tell everyone that he died due to AIDS because the many people present would take this to heart. Gogo created awareness with people who could relate to loosing a loved one to AIDS.
When something happens to you or a loved one, you are more aware and you will try harder to cause awareness.
Moreover, he died due to AIDS, that was the truth and well, the truth hurts but lies hurt more.
I find that it is very important to educate her family about the dangers of AIDS and that they must be able to take care of themselves to prevent them from getting it. But on the other hand i find that Bambo's funeral was not the right place for Gogo to do this. Someone in tutorial had mentioned that when there is a death of someone due to the illness people would be more affected. I disagree with this because using the death of Bambo to educate the family on AIDS kind of direspects him in a way because of the fact that society looks down upon people who have this disease. Even if they are family, learning that Bambo had died of AIDS changes the perception that the family had of him. If they looked at the children resentfully, would they not have changed how they saw their brother learning this information?
Why doesn’t she write down the question that she is asking the children or is there something she is hiding? Common assumptions we think that children don’t understand what is happening but they just want to say what adult wants them to hear. The barrier to learning a childs voice is that the children are not given the opputunity to speak but are expected to answer questions.translation is not the best way to here a child because not every language have proper translation.
Just a comment on Renatha's comment. I don't think it degrades Bambo what so ever, if anything he might have wanted that exactly. Why wouldn't you explain to the children what actually happened? There was a whole argument in class about whether or not there should have been an educational period at the funeral. It came down to the well being of the two children left behind, but by not telling them would eventually in the future hurt their well being in health and even future family. It's much better to know what you have in order to be able to treat it or control it or to be able to give reason as to why things are happening. Coming down to the social construct of it all which was Renatha's argument, there has to be that first step to create awareness or else keeping it in the dark doesn't create change or even propose to spark a change within that society. Everyone at that funeral, left a little more knowledgeable about their surroundings even if it did cost the social well being of the two children. It sounds cruel. Bitini was a respected man within the village and his death brought about awareness of the disease and probably made a bigger impact just because he was respected by so many in the village. So good on you Gogo.
after reading half of "Our Stories, Our Songs" it seems like the children (age 7-17) are already maturing to adulthood since their parent's died and now how to deal with the reality of life. Most children in Canada don't deal with that maturity until their are in their 20's and 30's...it's interesting how they realise that life isn't simple anymore at a very young age
I don't see a problem with Gogo revealing this information at her son's funeral. It was, very practically, a good opportunity to speak to a large crowd. Of course, it also allowed Deborah Ellis to address the fact that people don't often speak openly about AIDS. Maybe Ellis wanted this to be a controversial part of the book so that readers would consider the importance of overcoming the social stigma attached to AIDS.
As for Our Stories, Our Songs, I agree that translation can be a barrier to hearing the actual voice of the child. I also think that the children's stories would appear more authentic if Ellis hadn't put their words into such perfect phrasing and grammatically correct sentences. Even though their stories are different, their voices seem to be exactly the same.
In regards to Renatha's comment:
I do not think that this disrespects Bambo in fact I think he would be content with letting people know in order to spread awareness. For instance, when I tell people I got into a car accident, I am sure to mention that it was due to a drunk driver, in order to create awareness.
In addition, I'm sure many were affected; as for the uncle, he was simply the ignorant, selfish and cold character that Ellis decided to include in the novel. Anyway, the message cant be expected to get through to everyone. The fact remains that Im sure it affected at least a few.
In response to Ashley's comment:
The fact that Ellis had to rely on translators may have caused some alterations and variations. I'd like to think that the voice is authentic but at times I couldn't understand or believe that children thought and spoke in that specific manner. Its authentic to an extent. What do others think?
Ramandeep Bains,
After reading Our Stories Our Songs, I noticed that many of children just said their parents or relatives were sick and then they died. It probably meant they had aids, but they didn't talk about it. When we talked about if Gogo did the right thing to tell everyone her son died of aids some people agreed while others disagreed. I think she did the right thing and other people should talk about aids more openly because it will create awareness and it will get the issue of aids out in the open, which will hopefully make people do more about the aids crisis.
I think it is really good that there are anti aids clubs and the kicking aids out project because it gives the kids a chance to talk about aids and also learn more about how to prevent it or how to live with it.
Michael K.
Just like to add to the discussion we had in class about Our Stories Our Songs. Leslie pointed out something that I wanted to comment on (which I agreed with). She mentioned the lack of detail in the book, which there was, but only to keep it simple for children to able to read. But there wasn't enough detail either, leaving any questions the children had for the parents to answer. This could pose a problem for the author who is trying to get out a certain message because it brings in another view point into the analysis of the story. So, if there is not enough detail to satisfy the child's curiosity, then we have questions being asked to the guardian's of the child which might distort the true meaning of the book, either because the parent does not actually know the definitive answer and creates a misrepresentation of what actually is going on in those countries, or because they just want to mess around with their kids head. Anyway that's my thought. woop.
Michael Karabekos
oh and thats not actually stefanos, its my dads google account so it shows up as his name....for some reason...sry Neil :(.
reply to Stefanos aka Mike K lol
how much detail is needed to understand the meaning that comes across in the message of the book? by saying there isn't enough detail for children to understand than that's staying that we don't think children are capable of disecting themes and messages writen in that book today in tutorial
i'm not being an asshole but i'm just trying to start a debate (if what i'm saying makes any sense)
Post a Comment